The Pope of Hope: Egypt’s Tawadros II on status of Copts, regional politics and Saudi reforms

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Pope Tawadros II talks regional politics, status of Copts and his views on reforms in Saudi Arabia. (Photo: Ziyad Alarfaj)
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The pope, below right, in a file photo with Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman on his previous visit to Cairo in March. (AN photo by Ziyad Alarfaj)
Updated 06 December 2018
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The Pope of Hope: Egypt’s Tawadros II on status of Copts, regional politics and Saudi reforms

  • Tawadros spoke about the damage inflicted on the Copts in Egypt during the Muslim Brotherhood’s rule from 2012 to 2013
  • Tawadros is looking forward to visiting Saudi Arabia soon at the invitation of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman

CAIRO: It was July 21, 1969, and Neil Armstrong had just taken mankind’s first steps on the moon. In Egypt, 16-year-old Wagih Subhi Baqi Sulayman was transfixed by the achievement. More in hope than in any expectation of a reply, he wrote to the US astronaut asking for an autograph.

A few weeks later, to the young man’s surprise, an envelope arrived containing a signed, color photo of the moon landing.

Nearly 50 years later, while the hair is a little more gray, Wagih’s eyes remain very much on celestial matters. Of course, nobody refers to him by his birth name these days. For more than 100 million Egyptians, and to the rest of the world, he is now known as Tawadros II, the 118th Pope of Alexandria, Patriarch of the See of St. Mark and leader of the Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria.

He has, sadly, lost the moon landing photo — but never the memory of those days. With a soft voice and a gentle smile that lasted throughout our interview at St Mark’s Cathedral in the Abbassia district of Cairo, he recalled obtaining Armstrong’s address from a radio program on Voice of America that encouraged pen pals to write to him.




Pope Tawadros receives an Arab News cartoon commissioned in solidarity with Egyptians after a December 2016 attack on a church. The cartoon, by Mohammed Rayes, shows the word Cairo written using the C from a mosque’s crescent and a cross from a church. In picture: Editor in Chief Faisal Abbas and Noor Nuqali, Riyadh correspondent (AN photo)

“I sent him a letter, telling him I would love to see a color photo of him on the moon, because the newspapers used to publish his photo in black and white. I was surprised when I received the envelope.”

The teenager had assumed that Armstrong was named after the Nile River. “I was obsessed with his name. In the West, they are used to the name Neil. But here in Egypt no one would call his child Nile, although it is a beautiful name.”

The selection of Tawadros II as pope, a complex ritual, concluded in November 2012 and came at a difficult time for Egyptian Christians and the country in general. It was shortly after the collapse of the Mubarak presidency and coincided with the short-lived rule of the Muslim Brotherhood and the rise of Daesh. 

Our regions have been established with the existence of Christianity, Islam and Judaism. The meetings that the crown prince and Saudi officials are holding are very beneficial to the nation and the Kingdom. 

Pope Tawadros II

Tawadros leads nearly 15 million Copts in Egypt and a further 2 million abroad, according to the church’s registry. They practice a form of Christianity established 2,000 years ago by St. Mark, and, like most Christians and minorities in the region, have endured persecution at various times in their history. 

Recently, however, the persecution has become so widespread that the Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov called for an effort to protect Christians in the Middle East. Pope Tawadros agrees the situation is alarming. “Emptying the Middle East of Christians poses a great danger to stability and peace,” he says. “Christianity is deeply rooted in the Middle East.When all our countries were established, Christians and Muslims were there, as well as Jews in ancient history.” 

The pope describes events in Syria and Iraq, with the rise of Daesh, as “very painful,” and points out that Christians who had to flee and seek asylum abroad were among the most affected. However, his concerns extend beyond the plight of Christians alone, and he argues that a “weakening of Arab countries” means “the weakening of Arabs as a whole … Christians and Muslims alike.” 

Nevertheless, when it comes to his home country of Egypt, Tawadros is slightly more optimistic. “If you read through history, you will find that the Lebanese emigrated three centuries ago. However, the Christians in Egypt only started to emigrate 50 years ago, and that was due to the conditions that existed then.”

Under Muslim Brotherhood rule in 2012-2013, Tawadros says, “Christians feared for their lives and fled the country. When the country regained its stability, a lot of them returned to Egypt. Christian emigration rates have dropped significantly.” 

Despite the pope’s reassurances, many Copts are increasingly alarmed, their fear fueled by a surge in attacks on both them and their places of worship. Indeed, Egypt was highlighted as a country of concern in a report published this year by Open Doors, a US charity that supports persecuted Christians worldwide. 

Tawadros says that these attacks are painful, but insists that their target is not Copts themselves or their churches, but “Egyptian unity.” 

“To be fair, these attacks also targeted the armed forces, the police, and our brothers and sisters in mosques. One year ago, a mosque in Al-Arish region in North Sinai was a target for a terrorist attack where many Egyptians died.”

Nevertheless, one attack in particular this year was unprecedented. The body of Bishop Anba Epiphanius, abbot of the Monastery of St. Macarius, 100 km northwest of Cairo, was found with a crushed skull in his monastic cell in July. Those accused of the murder are traditionalists of his own faith, and they await trial. The crime appears to be directed at Pope Tawadros’ reformist, outward-looking and ecumenical policies. 

The pope denies the existence of a split in the church and says life as normal carries on in all monasteries. Such a one-off crime may happen “at any time and place,” he says. “Even between the disciples of Jesus, there was a disciple called Judas who sold his soul to evil. The authorities are now investigating this crime and we are waiting for the findings.”

As for Pope Tawadros’ own political views, at first he resists my attempts to persuade him to reveal them. “Religion should not interfere with politics,” he insists. But this is the Middle East, and “even if religion doesn’t want to interfere in politics, politics will interfere with religion,” I persevere. 

“The cause of crises in the world is this interference,” he replies with a sigh.

However, it would be a mistake to think that because the pope is reluctant to express his opinions, he does not have them. A year ago, he cancelled a meeting with US Vice President Mike Pence in protest at Washington’s decision to move its embassy in Israel to Jerusalem. The church said that the US decision had failed to “take into consideration the feelings of millions of Arab people.”

Tawadros views Palestine as an “occupied country,” and hopes a “spirit of understanding prevails” between Israelis and Palestinians so that Jerusalem can be a capital for both states “and peace reigns in the region.”

Leading a minority in a highly politicized part of the world, Coptic popes have always been careful with their positions. For instance, Cyril VI, pope from 1959 until his death in 1971, banned Copts from going to Jerusalem for pilgrimage after the Israeli occupation of 1967. The ban remained even after Egypt and Israel signed their peace treaty in 1979, and officially still does.

“The normalization … was between the Egyptian government and the Israeli government, but not between the two peoples,” explains Tawadros. However, he argues that the ban has ended up harming the Coptic presence in the Holy Land, and the rules have been slightly relaxed to allow elders who have children living abroad to travel to Jerusalem.

Tawadros himself made a rare visit there in 2015, to lead the funeral prayers for Bishop Abraham, the Coptic Metropolitan Archbishop of Jerusalem and the Near East. He also visited the Vatican in 2013, the first visit of a Coptic pope in 40 years, and his last trip was in July this year. “It is a good relationship based on friendship and love with Pope Francis,” he says. “There is a dialogue committee between us and the Vatican that meets annually.”

Meanwhile, on a state visit to Egypt this year, Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman invited Tawadros to the Kingdom, and all eyes are on when that visit might take place.

Tawadros found the crown prince “an open-minded person who has a modern vision to life, and this pleases us a lot. I personally follow all the positive developments that took place under the directives of King Salman, his crown prince and all Saudi officials, especially since Saudi Arabia is a main pillar of the Arab and the Islamic world, and on the international level as well.

“The meetings that the crown prince and Saudi officials are holding on all levels, whether religious, political or cultural, are very beneficial to the nation and the Kingdom and contribute to human development. We hail and appreciate these efforts that encompass a lot of hope for our brothers in Saudi Arabia.

So when will Pope Tawadros visit the Kingdom? “There is no specific time for the visit, but it will take place when God wishes,” he says.


Israel passes law that would allow it to deport the families of Palestinian attackers

Updated 10 sec ago
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Israel passes law that would allow it to deport the families of Palestinian attackers

JERUSALEM: Israel’s parliament passed a law early Thursday that would allow it to deport family members of Palestinian attackers, including the country’s own citizens, to the war-ravaged Gaza Strip or other locations.
The law, which was championed by members of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s Likud party and his far-right allies, passed with a 61-41 vote but is likely to be challenged in court.
It would apply to Palestinian citizens of Israel and residents of annexed east Jerusalem who knew about their family members’ attacks beforehand or who “express support or identification with the act of terrorism.”
They would be deported, either to the Gaza Strip or another location, for a period of 7 to 20 years. The Israel-Hamas war is still raging in Gaza, where tens of thousands have been killed and most of the population has been internally displaced, often multiple times.
It was unclear if it would apply in the occupied West Bank, where Israel already has a longstanding policy of demolishing the family homes of attackers. Palestinians have carried out scores of stabbing, shooting and car-ramming attacks against Israelis in recent years.
Dr. Eran Shamir-Borer, a senior researcher at the Israel Democracy Institute and a former international law expert for the Israeli military, said that if the law comes before the Supreme Court, it is likely to be struck down based on previous Israeli cases regarding deportation.
“The bottom line is this is completely non-constitutional and a clear conflict to Israel’s core values,” said Shamir-Borer.
Israel captured Gaza, the West Bank and east Jerusalem in the 1967 Mideast war, territories the Palestinians want for their future state. It withdrew settlers and soldiers from Gaza in 2005 but has reoccupied parts of the territory since Hamas’ Oct. 7, 2023 attack triggered the war.
Israel annexed east Jerusalem in a move not recognized by most of the international community. Palestinians there have permanent residency and are allowed to apply for citizenship, but most choose not to, and those who do face a series of obstacles.
Palestinians living in Israel make up around 20 percent of the country’s population. They have citizenship and the right to vote but face widespread discrimination. Many also have close family ties to those in the territories and most sympathize with the Palestinian cause.

Israel strikes Lebanon after discussing ‘Iranian threat’ with Trump

Updated 07 November 2024
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Israel strikes Lebanon after discussing ‘Iranian threat’ with Trump

  • The Israeli army had issued evacuation orders ahead of the strikes
  • Hezbollah had pledged the result of the US election would have no bearing on the war

JERUSALEM: Israel launched fresh strikes on south Beirut early Thursday, hours after Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and US president-elect Donald Trump spoke about the “Iranian threat.”
The Israeli premier was one of the first world leaders to congratulate Trump, calling the re-election “history’s greatest comeback.”
Over the phone on Wednesday, the pair “agreed to work together for Israel’s security” and “discussed the Iranian threat,” Netanyahu’s office said in a statement.
Not long afterwards, the Israeli military launched its latest strikes on Iran-backed Hezbollah’s main bastion of south Beirut, with AFP footage showing orange flashes and plumes of smoke over the densely populated suburb.
The Israeli army had issued evacuation orders ahead of the strikes, calling on people to leave four neighborhoods, including one near the international airport.
In Lebanon’s east, the country’s health ministry said Israeli strikes on Wednesday killed 40 people, with rescuers combing the rubble for survivors.
“The series of Israeli enemy strikes on the Bekaa Valley and Baalbek” killed “40 people and injured 53,” the ministry said in a statement.
Hezbollah had pledged the result of the US election would have no bearing on the war, which escalated in September as the Israeli military widened its focus from Gaza to securing its northern border with Lebanon.
In a televised speech recorded before Trump’s victory but aired afterwards, new Hezbollah chief Naim Qassem said: “We have tens of thousands of trained resistance combatants” ready to fight.
“What will stop this... war is the battlefield,” he said.
Qassem, who became Hezbollah secretary-general last week, warned that nowhere in Israel would be “off-limits.”
Hezbollah announced Wednesday it had Iran-made Fatah 110 missiles, a weapon with a 300-kilometer (186-mile) range that military expert Riad Kahwaji described as the group’s “most accurate.”
The group claimed a slew of attacks on Israel on Wednesday, including two that targeted naval bases near the Israeli city of Haifa and two near commercial hub Tel Aviv.
Hezbollah began its low-intensity cross-border campaign last year in support of ally Hamas after the Palestinian militants’ October 7 attack on Israel.
Israel escalated its air raids on Hezbollah strongholds in south Lebanon, Beirut and the eastern Bekaa Valley from September 23, sending in ground troops a week later.
More than a year of fighting in Lebanon has killed at least 3,050 people, the health ministry said Wednesday.
Ceasefire efforts
Efforts to end the conflicts in Gaza and neighboring Lebanon have so far repeatedly failed.
While US President Joe Biden’s administration has piled pressure on Netanyahu to agree to a truce, Washington sustained its political and military backing of Israel.
Many see Trump’s White House return as a possible boon for Israel.
All US presidents “are in favor of the State of Israel,” a man in east Jerusalem told AFP, asking to be identified only by his nickname Abu Mohammed.
Under Trump, “nothing will change except more decline.”
During his campaign, Trump touted himself as Israel’s strongest ally, going so far as to say Biden should let Israel “finish the job” against Hamas in Gaza.
“Trump’s return to power... will lead us to hell and there will be a greater and more difficult escalation,” said a school principal in the West Bank city of Ramallah.
Recent surveys have shown that a majority of Israelis, 66 percent according to one conducted by Israel’s Channel 12 News, were hoping to see Trump triumph.
Analysts said Netanyahu also wanted Trump’s return, given their longstanding personal friendship and the American’s hawkishness on Iran.
During his first term in office, Trump moved the US embassy to Jerusalem, recognized Israeli sovereignty over the occupied Golan Heights and helped normalize ties between Israel and several Arab states under the so-called Abraham Accords.
But some experts cautioned against prematurely assuming Trump’s position on “Israel’s treatment of Palestinians.”
“It’s not necessarily clear that he would kind of just stand aside while Israel continues to de facto annex the West Bank,” said Mairav Zonszein from the International Crisis Group.
Prospects of Peace in Trump’s US
Egypt, the first Arab state to sign a peace deal with Israel and one of the mediators in the stymied Gaza truce talks, also congratulated Trump.
President Abdel Fattah El-Sisi told Trump in a call that Cairo would work with him “to contribute to stability, peace and development in the Middle East.”
In Gaza, where the war has displaced most residents, caused widespread hunger and death, and devastated hospitals, some clung to hope with a change in the US administration.
“There’s nothing left for us, we want peace,” said 60-year-old Mamdouh Al-Jadba, who was displaced to Gaza City from Jabalia.
The UN said Wednesday its polio vaccination campaign in Gaza had ended, with more than half a million children vaccinated despite the war.
Hamas’s October 7, 2023 attack that started the war resulted in 1,206 deaths, mostly civilians, according to an AFP tally of Israeli official figures.
Israel’s retaliatory campaign has killed 43,391 people in Gaza, a majority of them civilians, according to figures from the Hamas-run territory’s health ministry, which the United Nations considers reliable.


Israel, WHO say evacuated dozens of Gazans for medical care

Updated 07 November 2024
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Israel, WHO say evacuated dozens of Gazans for medical care

  • The WHO said the “patients included those with autoimmune diseases, blood diseases, cancer, kidney conditions and trauma injuries”

JERUSALEM: Israel and the World Health Organization said more than 200 Gazans, both patients and their carers, were evacuated to the United Arab Emirates or Romania Wednesday for medical treatment.
In total, the group numbered some 230 people, according to the WHO and COGAT, the Israeli defense ministry body responsible for civil affairs in the Palestinian territories.
“This is the largest number of patients and caregivers who have left through the Kerem Shalom crossing in recent months,” COGAT said in a statement.
The operation was carried out in cooperation with the UAE, the European Union and the WHO, it added.
The WHO said the “patients included those with autoimmune diseases, blood diseases, cancer, kidney conditions and trauma injuries.”
The patients were transferred from Gaza via the Kerem Shalom crossing into Israel, and then to Ramon Airport near Eilat in southern Israel.
The WHO’s representative in the Palestinian territories, Rik Peeperkorn, had said Tuesday that those on the evacuation list were among up to 14,000 people currently waiting in Gaza to be evacuated for medical reasons.
Hamas’s October 7, 2023 attack on Israel resulted in the deaths of 1,206 people, mostly civilians, according to an AFP tally of Israeli official figures.
Israel’s retaliatory campaign has killed 43,391 people in Gaza, a majority of them civilians, according to Gaza health ministry figures which the United Nations considers to be reliable.
The ministry also lists 102,347 people as having been wounded in the Gaza Strip since the war began.
Peeperkorn said Tuesday that fewer than 5,000 people had been granted medical evacuations out of the territory since the war began.


Gazans want Donald Trump to end war

Updated 07 November 2024
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Gazans want Donald Trump to end war

  • Israel demolishes seven Palestinian homes in East Jerusalem, declaring them ‘illegal’

GAZA, JERUSALEM: Palestinians in Gaza want Donald Trump, who won the US election, to end the war between Israel and Hamas that has devastated their territory.

“We were displaced, killed ... there’s nothing left for us, we want peace,” Mamdouh Al-Jadba, who was displaced to Gaza City from Jabalia, said.

“I hope Trump finds a solution, we need someone strong like Trump to end the war and save us, enough, God, this is enough,” said the 60-year-old. “I was displaced three times, my house was destroyed, my children are homeless in the south ... There’s nothing left, Gaza is finished.”

Umm Ahmed Harb, from the Al-Shaaf area east of Gaza City, was also counting on Trump to “stand by our side” and end the territory’s suffering.

“God willing the war will end, not for our sake but for the sake of our young children who are innocent, they were martyred and are dying of hunger,” she said.

“We cannot buy anything with the high prices (of food). We are here in fear, terror and death.”

For Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, where violence has also surged since October last year, Trump’s victory was reason to fear for the future.

“Trump is firm in some decisions, but these decisions could serve Israel’s interests politically more than they serve the Palestinian cause,” said Samir Abu Jundi, a 60-year-old in the city of Ramallah.

Another man who identified himself only by his nickname, Abu Mohammed, said he also saw no reason to believe Trump’s victory would be in favor of the Palestinians, saying “nothing will change except more decline.”

Imad Fakhida, a school principal in the main West Bank city of Ramallah, said “Trump’s return to power ... will lead us to hell and there will be a greater and more difficult escalation.”

He added: “He is known for his complete and greatest support for Israel.”

During his campaign for a return to the White House, Trump said Gaza, which is located on the eastern Mediterranean, could be “better than Monaco.”

He also said he would have responded the same way as Israel did following the Oct. 7 attack, while urging the US ally to “get the job done” because it was “losing a lot of support.”

More broadly he has promised to bring an end to raging international crises, even saying he could “stop wars with a telephone call.”

In Gaza, such statements gave reason for hope. “We expect peace to come and the war to end with Trump because in his election campaign he said that he wants peace and calls for stopping the wars on Gaza and the Middle East,” said Ibrahim Alian, 33, from Gaza City.

Like many of the territory’s residents, Alian has been displaced several times by the fighting. He said he also lost his father to the war.

“God willing the war on the Gaza Strip will end and the situation will change,” he said.

Meanwhile, municipal workers demolished seven homes in occupied East Jerusalem’s Silwan neighborhood on Tuesday, Palestinian residents and the municipality said, after an Israeli court called their construction illegal.

“This morning the Jerusalem municipality, with a security escort from the Israel police, began its enforcement against illegal buildings in the Al-Bustan neighborhood in Silwan,” Jerusalem’s Israeli-controlled city hall said in a statement.


UN says Gaza polio vaccination campaign complete

Updated 06 November 2024
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UN says Gaza polio vaccination campaign complete

  • The second round of the polio vaccination campaign in the Gaza Strip was completed Tuesday, with an overall 556,774 children under the age of 10 being vaccinated
  • An estimated 7,000 to 10,000 children are stuck in “inaccessible areas” in the north and “remain unvaccinated”

JERUSALEM: The UN said Wednesday its Gaza child polio vaccination drive was complete, with more than half a million children vaccinated despite the Israel-Hamas war raging in the Palestinian territory.
The World Health Organization and the United Nations children’s agency UNICEF launched a second round of vaccinations in northern Gaza on Saturday after Israeli bombing halted an earlier attempt to do so.
“The second round of the polio vaccination campaign in the Gaza Strip was completed yesterday (Tuesday), with an overall 556,774 children under the age of 10 being vaccinated with a second dose,” said a joint statement.
It “is a remarkable achievement given the extremely difficult circumstances the campaign was executed under.”
Israel’s military has pounded northern Gaza for weeks in a major offensive it says is aimed at stopping Hamas militants from regrouping.
An estimated 7,000 to 10,000 children are stuck in “inaccessible areas” in the north and “remain unvaccinated and vulnerable to the poliovirus,” the UN organizations said.
The vaccination campaign had been a “success,” according to a statement Wednesday from COGAT, the Israeli defense ministry body that manages civilian affairs in the Palestinian territories.
The drive began on September 1 with a successful first round, after the besieged territory confirmed its first polio case in 25 years.
Typically spread through sewage and contaminated water, poliovirus is highly infectious.
It can cause deformities and paralysis and is potentially fatal, mainly affecting children aged under five.
The vaccination campaign was managed primarily by UN agencies including the WHO, UNICEF and UNRWA — the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees.
Last month Israel’s parliament adopted a law banning UNRWA’s activities on Israeli territory.
The aid agency remains “the largest primary health care provider in the Gaza Strip,” according to Louise Wateridge, UNRWA’s senior emergency officer.
The WHO said Saturday four children were among six people wounded in a strike on a polio vaccination center in northern Gaza.
It was unclear who carried out the attack.
The UN agencies on Wednesday again called for a ceasefire.
“Humanitarian pauses... must be systematically applied beyond the polio emergency response efforts to other health and humanitarian interventions to respond to dire needs,” they said.